The chat
$
Tachy-on:
Before we get started with questions from the community, would you like to tell
us about your experience at SXSW and all of dA's happenings in Austin?
$
spyed:
Hey thanks. It hurts my body to be here. I'm in a tumble of day being night and
night being day. I have no idea what day it is. I just get texts to where the next
party is and that's pretty much my schedule. More specifically the deviantART
Sandbox is amazing, and our team is working hyper hard here to wake up early
and keep the lounges going. So, awesome? :)
The Austin, TX deviantMEET was epic! There were two real llamas - A mamma
llama and baby llama! I got the baby llama and mamma llama to collaborate with
deviantART muro on a piece on my iPad 2! Llamas may not be very good
artists, but I do love that dA muro makes the arts approachable even for llamas.
I mean, literally, without dA muro there'd be no way
for a llama to interact directly with deviantART. And you know, that's what we're
all about.
=
demonmudkipsrox:
If for some reason, deviantART was never created, what would you be doing?
$
spyed: I'd still be building a
community. I started when I was 12 years old building communities, so you'd
have to have shifted the date of my birth or maybe where I grew up or something
to get me change what I'm doing. I think a lot of things about deviantART are
shaped around my exposure to Bulletin Board Systems (BBS) when I was really
young, playing DooM, Quake, Hexen, Heretic and being totally blown away by
the subcommunities around it and the incredible environments available at the
time for people to connect and talk. But, those systems were limited to 40 or 60
or 120 people at a time, unlike the web.
As we transitioned to the Internet in 1996 or so, the potential was much
greater with everyone being connected, but the systems were rudimentary by
comparison. All I've really wanted to do was rebuild BBSs for the web, allowing
others to connect with people who inspire them in intimate digital settings. I'm
really glad it was art, creativity and the architecture of a loving supportive
society within which to share.
Thanks for the question, I haven't really answered that one before.
$
spyed:
For me, personally, I think the last question kind of answers this one. More
directly the history of deviantART has multiple co-founders who came together
at the right moment to bring deviantART to the world, including Scott (°
jark), Matt
(°
matteo), and early contributions by $
mccann, $
chris, °
spot, and others. I'd say we
started deviantART because of the online application skin community and the
artists involved in it. Some of those artists weren't satisfied with just submitting
application skins -- they also had paintings and other art works, so we responded
to that need. °
matteo provided a more specific vision during the founding days
which really fueled our diversity at that moment, deviating from what existed in
the space. And obviously, people loved it.
`
electricjonny:
With every other site in the universe integrating with Facebook and Twitter ("Like" buttons everywhere), how does, or how will, dA work to not be
left behind, but also not simply copy everyone else? I think it's important for
dA to integrate with the rest of those sites, but to just straight up copy everyone
else and look like another cookie cutter site with all of those buttons added in might
be a bad idea I think. How do you balance things with not being
left behind, but still staying unique?
$
spyed:
I do think it's a matter of choice. You'd think, out there in the world, that
Facebook Like buttons are an absolute requirement of some kind. deviantART
doesn't currently support these buttons for a few good reasons, but we will
support Facebook and Twitter more this year. deviantART's growth and
membership hasn't been impacted by not supporting Like buttons. We continue
to grow at a rapid clip and at much the same speed and consistency we always
have, so I've never felt a sense of urgency around it. I think waiting to see
the landscape evolve is really important for deviantART. A lot of decisions by
Facebook have left me literally speechless, so I think I've tried to preserve a bit of
a sanctuary from the insanity for a moment to let some of the dust settle.
Integration is very easy and very quick the moment we want to add Like buttons
or Facebook connect, but those guys have some privacy issues to deal with still,
and they need to show a bit more of their hand to the world in terms of what they
intend to do with all this data before deviantART overtly endorses what they're
doing. I could talk more about this, but basically from the perspective of people
building networks for many years I think some of what Facebook is getting away
with is rather incredible and I think it's because people don't understand what
they're agreeing to.
=
TimberClipse:
Angelo, thank you so much for having this night! Aside from the obvious of
creating art, what can the deviant community do to support you as well as other
deviants and admins in the community at this time?
$
spyed:
Honestly this is a great question and I really took a moment to think before
responding.
deviantART's single most important attribute is our Culture. It isn't our features,
our version revisions, or any of the other things we update you on regularly. It's
always been about our Culture. The meaning behind "deviantART Loves You!"
has been very important from the day we began, but I think other brands and
sites have copied it and given it a more vanilla meaning which really upsets me.
I had our trademark firms trademark the term, because I wanted to fight back
when the term was cheapened by other companies. It's an important,
fundamental, core concept for our Culture and it's always been a fight to keep our
Culture positive.
I hate trolls. Anyone involved in any community hates trolls. Lately we have a bit
of a troll problem, because I think our core Cultural pillar in "deviantART Loves
You!" has been diluted a bit, the spirit behind it as the community has grown
has lost a bit of meaning. We have a few really aggressive strategies this year
that focus on this that we'll announce soon, but in the meantime, I need you
guys to realize that this very room of people is very special and very important to
deviantART.
I want you to know that I recognize how incredibly important this room of people
is, plus the people who would have been here or wanted to be here. You guys
care a tremendous amount about deviantART or else you wouldn't be spending
your time here with me today. There's lots going on out there on the Internet. So,
for you:
- There are 80 of us who work at deviantART, and I think only a % of that team
works directly with the community. We have operations people, and engineers
who don't post, so maybe 50 of those people interact with the site.
- We have volunteers, and many of them are incredible! But they aren't full staff
members and they can't help with a lot of things, so there's a perception that
there's many more of us than there really are.
- There are millions of you. And on a lot of networks the staff doesn't engage
or manage Culture the way we do, and that's what makes deviantART quite
different.
So if you're here, what we need from you is for you to help us carry on our
mission of 'deviantART Loves You!' with the same sense of pride that we do
and the same passion with which deviantART was bonded in 2000 for the artists
of then and now. And this means you need to have some courage because
some of the people you encounter are amazing, and some of them are less
amazing, and some of them are incredible, and some of them are irritating. To
truly be devious, you must have patience and balance with this fight, because
it's the good fight. Losing your patience is a problem for all of us, and a poor
representation of how we're supposed to be here. If this place loses that, I'll feel
that we have failed and I'd have a really hard time with that. It's not wires and text
boxes that keep our community flowing... it's us!
*
GoddessOfCake:
Do you think that dA muro has had a great influence on the deviantART
community? Are there any plans for additions to strengthen that influence?
$
spyed:
Yep! When we started the chat I talked a bit about deviantART muro and I
think watching a llama and a baby llama use their noses to draw using an iPad
and dA muro really underlines and highlights how accessible this tool makes
deviantART. dA muro is a core and permanent product of deviantART, like the
message center, search, profile pages, deviation pages and groups. I consider it
core because it sets our product teams perspective on the landscape correctly. I
think a writing tool will follow that's equally important and I think an environment
that encompasses these types of tools is also important to the submission
process and one of the core use cases for deviants.
So, a lot of product is being built in and around dA muro. This tool will see
continued advancements month after month. I think the thing that
really clinches it is being able to play back the creation of deviations, so you can
see how they're made and being able to tune in live as people draw. We develop
products live, with you, so that you're a part of every step of the process and can
watch the evolution. deviantART muro is only in its humble beginnings.
We've had so many incredible artists consult on every aspect of it: how the
brushes work, if they're fast enough, how layers work, how filters work. The lead
developer behind dA muro, $
mudimba, is a really fantastic artist himself. It's a
project we all love, and while it's still very early on and there's some confusion as
to its final positioning within deviantART, all will be crystal clear soon as dA muro
ascends to perhaps the most widely used drawing tool in the world within the not
too distant future.
=
Topicality:
Are there any examples of how companies have used deviantART to look for
clients to do artwork? In the future, do you think any projects specifically for
companies to look for clienteles on deviantART would be feasible?
$
spyed:
Basically the answer is yes. Big time.
It's a challenging problem for a few internal reasons. First, we have a hard
problem to tackle when we make the arts more accessible for hire. I think we're
very protective of you guys, and we're very aware of how the web is used for
hiring people and there's a fine line between good and evil on this one. We're
toeing that line in order to protect deviants. I'm not too worried about trained
designers and people who work already, who will be greatly served by a
deviantART platform for accessing deviants for work. We are worried about the
youngins and less experienced professionals.
So, for example, take our thumbshare forum on deviantART, rename it Jobs! and
let companies post jobs for some price per post or something. We could turn that
system around in about a week probably, but there's a lot more to consider when
you get in to the details, and the devil is definitely in the details on this.
But if you look closer at Portfolios which are doing incredibly well considering
how little we promote them, and build a directory around them and then build in
guidelines for how people access artists and maybe consider publishing the paid
rates, we start having more information to share with artists about how to set
prices so they don't get screwed over.

So that's a larger project but, very much
something we're looking at this year.
*
Rickbw1:
Hello Angelo. Will DA be adding in the shops a way to create books for art
collections, literature, etc like Blurb, and if so when? And if not why?
$
spyed:
We'd likely partner with a company like Blurb, they're amazing, but first we need
to change the submission process to add some procedures for how we integrate
with such companies. That is stuff we're looking at and developing against right
now, so, absolutely!
`
Athos-of-light:
deviantART seems to be having a lot more focus on IRL stuffs, such as The
World Tour, 10th b-day bash + official devmeets world wide, now the deviantART Sandbox
at SXSW. Is dA looking to do more IRL facetime with users? What have been
the benefits for staff and users, as well as the site? Are there plans to keep this
rolling, having staff gather at meets at other major cities and events? Do you feel
these large scale devmeets improve staff-user relations, and promote growth of
creativity, collaboration, and community?
$
spyed:
Pretty much yes on everything you just said. The World Tour was the most
incredible experience of I think both my life and $
Heidi's, and the perspective
we brought back shines through in every decision we've been making
since. I think we're going to open the doors to HQ at some point this year and let
members hang out with us every day and if that works out the way we're planning
it, I think we'll expand to top countries with physical ways to hang out and draw.
The sheer number of people who show up to our meets warrant this and I think
connecting people IRL is what ultimately fulfills the mission of deviantART: to truly
enhance the lives of our members.
=
TheK:
With the previous generation forming the current modern day world, and
with it being so fast paced with increasing innovations in technology and
competitiveness around the world, what advice would you give to the current
generation trying to start up a business?
$
spyed:
Oooh a fellow entrepreneur, aye? It's funny, I wrote a few paragraphs about
this last night before I fell asleep. I mean this morning, when I went to sleep,
at 9am.
Everything has changed, but everything is still the same. If you're starting a
business in this environment, it's just as challenging as it has always been, but
the rules remain the same: businesses need to be built where they are needed
and not where a businessman wants to be necessarily.
It's very rare to build a business and also love the business, as those are even
harder businesses to build; but I assume you're asking me because I'm the single
luckiest person in the world and I get to do what I love most while also building
a business. So to that end, it depends what you love and what opportunity you
see in that space. The important thing is always going to be determination. A
business is going to test you to your very core, challenge your every emotion and
I think the key to success is fighting through all the pain and all the challenge.
As $
mccann and I love to talk about, there's very little difference between a
completely crazy person and an entrepreneur. They both see things that don't
exist, and live their lives as if they do. So be prepared to be crazy, and to
find comfort there, even if that's kind of strange advice. All I really wanted to
underscore and what I try to talk to entrepreneurs about is that the challenge
and tenacity is most of it. Ideas are a dime a dozen, execution is 90%
of everything successful.
`
Baz135:
deviantART has a great forum community, however the forums themselves
could do with some work. Are we ever going to be seeing that forum update that
was promised? If not that, then what other updates or new features can we look
forward too?
$
spyed:
I think both Forums and Chat are out of date in a similar way. They really
need upgrades and updates pretty badly and we're having a hard time routing
resources towards them. It's not because we don't want to, but because there
are areas of the site that are far more widely used that are also in great need of
upgrades. We're trying to line up resources
for Chat once the Search engine group beefs up. We're looking for C++ type
developers very aggressively and it's become really really hard to identify good
talent for this group.
Forums are wrapped in to a greater network inefficiency. As Forums exist in
Groups in backrooms and in the commonly known Forums environment, there is
also desire for Forums in Groups in public facing areas. So I think we're going to
look at that overall bundle of tangled wires and iron it out. I have to say, I think
the Forums are a little scary for us to touch. We once tried to make the Shoutbox
run off of dAmn so the Shoutbox channel was in real time, and this was pretty
much greeted with angry mobs holding pitch forks. I think changing the Forums
might get us killed, so it's not just an engineering problem -- it's a social issue
and the Forum folks are really hardcore. Even
lolly once told me, if you touch the
forums I'll fn' kill you.
So I took that a little too much to heart. I think if the Forum community articulated
exactly what they wanted done, we could probably accommodate. (Have your
say at $
chix0r's
journal)
=
riseofthefall:
You have an amazing art website! Did you ever think you would be this big 5
years ago? And do where do you see the website in 10 years?
$
spyed:
We set out to change the world. I think there's a blind ambition around these
things. We started nearly 11 years ago, and we were all young, and excited, and
in tune with what we wanted to see the web do. So I think we really knew what
we were doing even if we didn't know we knew what we were doing.
The people I met during those years were some of the most intuitive people
about the web that I think I'll ever know. It's like we had discovered a wide
open new world and everything and anything was possible. We set our sights
and I don't think we've really looked back with any regret. It always felt right, and it
continues to feel right.
In 10 years, I see deviantART fulfilling its mission to bring the arts back in to
mainstream culture. By then, it will have already happened. Artists will be
accessible, art curated to taste for each person, venues performing dynamically
curated collections for the public and a greater percentage of society will be
releasing their creativity to the world than today.
~
Parka87:
In your experience, I guess, you had to make difficult choices. It's been like a
decade of changes and innovations, but in the end, I believe it all sums up to the
most fundamental questions. So, egg or chicken?
$
spyed:
Andrew you have a good take on this.
$
mccann:
Which one, chicken or egg? I'm afraid I may not be sure what you're asking.
If about chicken/egg... Science has shown it was Chicken ;) As for dA, the
concept and vision came first, and though revised as time goes on, I certainly
know from my own perspective that dA is on the cusp of becoming much closer
to the ideas of 11 years ago.
~
finwe:
Hello from Turkey. =) And sorry for the following long question with my deficient
English. Since deviantART is an online community, where people are here
for sharing their art on main purpose, why is deviantART very strict about not
developing an open API for individual developers to create lots of external
applications for their desktops, mobile devices, browsers, or for other social
networks to expand sharing their art via deviantART? I know deviantART cares
about the privacy and copyright topics a lot, but couldn't these problems be
resolved by some simple user based privacy settings?
$
spyed:
We will be releasing some public facing API's this year.
`
SaTaNiA:
Do you have any plans to expand the presence of dA in Europe, like maybe
an office, shows or lounges (like The deviantART Sandbox at SXSW) or more
communication around the already awesome super staff we got there? It would
be really lovely for all of us to see real and concrete events like the ones you hold
in the US here in Europe.
$
spyed:
We'd love to. I think it's a matter of time and money, but I think we're on the cusp
of beginning these types of broader plans and strategies as we go in to 2012.
$
spyed:
Things that will upset you greatly.
*
KovoWolf:
First and foremost I would like to thank you for your dedication and heart to this
amazing art community. I'm humbled every day to be apart of it and to support
such an amazing community for as long as I've been here. It has been a great
experience to have sat back and watched dA's growth over the years and all
the features you bring to us, the deviants, and really take the time to listen to
the community. My thanks also goes to all the deviants hard at work to keep it
running smoothly as it does

Thank you!
What is your favorite art style/medium you follow on deviantART? Are there a few
deviants you like to watch on a daily basis?
$
spyed:
I love street photography and have an affinity for the types of people who are
street photographers. They tend to have an interesting view of society that
fluctuates from love to hate in a full spectrum of understanding and I think that
makes those people feel really in tune and raw. I like raw people so I like street
photography.
`
LostKitten:
Will Groups see any improvements in the future? As someone involved
with Groups since their release, I've contemplated multiple suggestions for
improvement: Like a standard Group FAQ tab, the ability to apply for different
roles while currently in a role (i.e Member applies for Contributor), an Affiliate tab
(where affiliate admins can promote their events and members can decide if they
want to see that news).
And what ever happened to Groups getting point donation pools? Needing
a deviant account to accumulate points is moving backward, to the club-era.
Groups need points--namely for Super Group upgrade (it's not cheap). Thanks.
$
spyed:
Yes, Groups are going to get a lot of attention this year.
$
spyed:
As a closing sentiment there's a topic that didn't really come up and I wanted to
cover it. Question for me by me:
deviantART is currently in version 7, any
word on version 8?
We're officially ready to talk about the development of version 8. It will definitely
piss people off and they will definitely want version 7 back, until a few months go
by and then people would be really upset if we changed version 8 and it became
version 9.

There's going to be a difference this time though, in that it won't be a wide
release without prior notice and it's suddenly all v8. deviantART v8 is largely powered by a massive
underlining architecture change that $
mccann has been leading over the past
number of
years. The new search engine architecture will have a massive
impact on just about every aspect of deviantART over time, beginning with the
home page and expanding in to the message center and beyond.
So, as we unlock the chat today and let everyone talk for a while, I wanted to say
thanks to Andrew for what has been an incredibly lonely mission in invention and
a testament to his incredible contributions to deviantART. You've yet to see this
thing, but I'm playing with it as we design v8, and the power we have to bring
experiences to you that we've always wanted to is now there because of him.
It's the type of work you can't really see. Dozens of systems that work together
seamlessly. If done right, the very point is to take the whole
thing for granted and use it without thinking about it being there. It's the kind of
stuff that makes you ultimately feel like deviantART is awesome, and you get to
browse art and connect with people.
But just like being in a cold data center, it's grey, colorless, and cold, which is
a stark contradiction to what you'd think it means to "run the world's largest art
community". So, there's a little emote called "worship" that looks like

this

If you could please use it a few times, for $
mccann, as we unlock the
room. Thanks
Note: this transcript was edited for clarity.